The Progress Curve: Are Your Skills Keeping Pace? with Michelle Froah, ETS

[00:00:00] MRII Announcer: Welcome 

[00:00:01] MRII Announcer: to MRII’s 

[00:00:02] MRII Announcer: Insights and Innovators podcast, where we talk to top market research professionals to get their inside stories about innovative and enduring best practices. Today’s episode is sponsored by MMR Research Associates. MMR Research Associates is an agile full service marketing research firm with a global support network that performs customized research around the world.

[00:00:25] MRII Announcer: Now here’s your host for today’s episode. 

[00:00:27] Stan Sthanunathan: Hi everyone. Thanks for joining today’s episode of Insights and Innovators. I’m your host, Stan Sanatan. Today’s topic is all about how to stay relevant and get ahead in a rapidly changing world, and more importantly, the role of skills development in that journey.

[00:00:46] Stan Sthanunathan: We are certainly at a crossroad within the insights industry, and it go as it goes through transformation. And I’m sure you’ll find the session very useful. We have a great guest for this topic, [00:01:00] Michelle roa. Michelle is Chief Global Marketing and Innovation Officer at ETS and also SVP of Corporate Solutions.

[00:01:08] Stan Sthanunathan: In this episode, Michelle shares her perspective on skill development. Credentialing and adaptations to turbocharge your career. There’s a lot to be learned from a varied experience in great marketing organizations like Procter and Gamble, Kimberly Clark, Samsung, and more recently, MetLife before she joined ETS.

[00:01:30] Stan Sthanunathan: Welcome, Michelle. 

[00:01:32] Michell Froah: Thank you. Thank you. So lovely to be here. 

[00:01:35] Stan Sthanunathan: Thank you. Thanks for, uh, making time for us. Let’s start with your background and career journey. Uh, by the way, we share something in common. We both are engineers before we became marketers. 

[00:01:47] Michell Froah: Oh my goodness. Fantastic. And what kind of engineer?

[00:01:50] Stan Sthanunathan: Mechanical engineer. And what about you 

[00:01:52] Michell Froah: The best. 

[00:01:53] Stan Sthanunathan: What about you? 

[00:01:55] Michell Froah: I’m mechanical as well. 

[00:01:56] Stan Sthanunathan: Oh 

[00:01:57] yeah, I know, 

[00:01:58] Michell Froah: right. And, uh, [00:02:00] funny. It’s like, uh, we have a whole family of that. My, my husband is also a mechanical engineer. Yeah. Uh, we met in, in, uh, college and my son is a budding mechanical engineer. Just getting ready to graduate in June.

[00:02:13] Stan Sthanunathan: Brilliant. You know, all great engineers are mechanical engineers. I would like, tell me, how did transition from engineering to marketing happen? 

[00:02:25] Michell Froah: Well, you know, I, um, boy, such a, such a long story. But, um, you know, what I would start with first is that, uh, I’ve, I think I’ve always been inspired by, um, a poem, um, that, uh, you know, was.

[00:02:44] Michell Froah: Something that, um, you know, really resonated with me even back when I was in high school. Um, and that poem was taking the road less traveled. Do you know that poem? Right. Um, so, you know, there’s a line in the poem. Two Roads [00:03:00] Diverged in a Wood, and I took the one less traveled by and that has made all the difference.

[00:03:05] Hmm. 

[00:03:06] Michell Froah: And so I, I share that because I think. First and foremost, you know, one of those path less traveled by was becoming a mechanical engineer. Mm-hmm. And then actually putting that in into play. You know, I worked at, uh, Procter and Gamble for my first assignment, um, in a manufacturing plant. Um, and, um, working in a company like p and g, um, where, you know, I think there’s.

[00:03:33] Michell Froah: It, there’s such a great culture at at p and g where people invest in you, uh, you know, as, as a person, as a leader, but also there’s so many opportunities across the organization. Right. And there was another road, um, you know, that emerged, uh, that was a little less traveled of. Going from engineering and product supply into [00:04:00] marketing.

[00:04:00] Michell Froah: Mm-hmm. And, um, you know, I think I, I became very interested in that route, um, for, for a couple of reasons. One, I was, uh, doing my MBA at night while I worked in the plant. And I thought, wow, this was really interesting. Um, you know, to think about a business, um, more holistically. Mm-hmm. And two. Um, I worked on, uh, some initiatives, you know, that were broader, you know, new innovation initiatives in bringing, um, that those brand innovations into the plant to start up.

[00:04:35] Michell Froah: Um, right. And so I started having more exposure to, um, other functions and I thought. Wow. Like there’s actually people that sit and think about consumers and what consumers think about. And um, you know, it isn’t decisions only for efficiency of how we run things on the line. Of course, those are very important things as [00:05:00] well.

[00:05:00] Michell Froah: But how do you really differentiate, um, your products and your, and your value proposition? To really deliver on real consumer needs. And at p and g, you know, there was this whole, uh, notion that, uh, that customer is boss. 

[00:05:18] Hmm. 

[00:05:19] Michell Froah: And in order to. Stand what the boss wants. You have to understand what they need and, you know, and so having, you know, a real desire to, um, you know, bring insights into action, um, was one of the things that, um, drew me into, um, uh, uh, into marketing.

[00:05:41] Michell Froah: And I think to answer your question about transition, I think it was an interesting transition. Um, you know, there’s. Uh, there, it was not unheard of within p and g, you know, for different functions to go into marketing. Um, marketing kind of was the, the hub of [00:06:00] the wheel if, if you will. Um, but I, I think there were probably a lot more sales folks that, uh, uh, and, and leaders that went into marketing than necessarily, um, manufacturing or, or engineers.

[00:06:14] Michell Froah: And so I think the. The transition of being a creative problem solver 

[00:06:22] was 

[00:06:22] Michell Froah: very beneficial. 

[00:06:23] Mm-hmm. 

[00:06:24] Michell Froah: And so sometimes I, I’m, I’m, I’m very grateful that I have, you know, both a. Rational problem solving, you know, um, engineering background. Mm-hmm. But also this creative, um, mindset and training of, of, you know, how do you, um, you know, apply marketing and, and innovation, you know, in new spaces.

[00:06:48] Michell Froah: And so sometimes I have to say, I have a. I’m a creative, um, marketer, or I’m sorry, creative engineer, but a practical marketer. Right. And I’ll try and use both sides of my brain. [00:07:00] But, um, so that part I think was an easy transition. Um, also when you’re in a, in, you know, when you’re an engineer in a manufacturing environment, I was leading production teams.

[00:07:11] Mm. So 

[00:07:12] Michell Froah: I was trying to. You know, I sometimes say play whack-a-mole with all of the, the different variables you, you needed, you know, to lower your costs, you needed to increase quality, increase safety, increase organizational capability, like all these things that could go in different directions. And, you know, being like a general manager really of your area was a very transferable skill, if you will, as, as you went into marketing and, and business management.

[00:07:42] Michell Froah: But on the other hand, um, you know, I think, uh, uh, it was very easy for my management, my new management to say. Um, oh wow. Michelle has, you know, project management skills and, um, you, you know, we should [00:08:00] just put her in charge of the critical path schedule of a project versus like, let’s go do the. The actual marketing activities, you know, for whatever.

[00:08:11] Michell Froah: So I did have to fight a little bit, you know, to not just utilize my strengths, but also help expand and, and grow into, you know, this marketing profession. I. 

[00:08:23] Stan Sthanunathan: That’s, that’s awesome. There’s a lot of similarities with what I have gone through, but let’s not go there. 

[00:08:29] Michell Froah: Right. That could be the whole conversation.

[00:08:31] Michell Froah: I, 

[00:08:32] Stan Sthanunathan: yeah. And now I would love to ask you a few questions about learnings that you can share based on your professional experience. But before that, I certainly want to ask you about the ETS Human Progress Report. Can you please share with us, uh, some big highlights from this report, because that sounds really fascinating.

[00:08:53] Michell Froah: Right. Well, so you know a little bit about, um, ETS and, and, and why we’ve [00:09:00] published the Human Progress report might, might help a little bit. So, um, you know, ETS historically has, um, has a huge reputation. Mm-hmm. Uh, strong reputation in the educational testing. Area. Right. So long, long standing. Um, and as we, one of, one of the reasons I was so drawn to, to this company was because it’s mission based.

[00:09:26] Michell Froah: Hmm. And, you know, and, and it has like a real purpose, um, and taking our expertise from the educational, um, arena and applying that into, you know, where. People as lifelong learners need that same expertise. 

[00:09:45] Mm-hmm. 

[00:09:46] Michell Froah: Um, in the workforce and along other periods of, uh, of their life and career journey, um, is such a great business transformation to be part of.

[00:09:55] Mm-hmm. Um, 

[00:09:56] Michell Froah: and, and really, you know, that expands [00:10:00] the impact of our mission. 

[00:10:01] Mm-hmm. And that 

[00:10:02] Michell Froah: mission is. To advance the science of measurement, how are human progress? Um, and, and so, you know, that measurement piece, which I know we’re gonna be talking a lot about here, you know, are, are really, uh, you know, helping people to demonstrate, um, their proficiency 

[00:10:23] mm-hmm.

[00:10:23] Of, 

[00:10:24] Michell Froah: of, of, you know, skills and whether that’s technical, durable, et cetera. But. You know, there are challenges that people face in achieving that human progress. And so last year, um, in 2024, when we relaunched, um, ETS, um, as, as a brand, uh, we, we published our first human progress report. 

[00:10:49] Mm-hmm. And 

[00:10:50] Michell Froah: this January, we published our, our second.

[00:10:53] Michell Froah: Um, and so the Human Progress Report really was aimed at, uh, looking across the globe. So [00:11:00] 18 countries, 18,000 participants. 

[00:11:03] Mm-hmm. 

[00:11:04] Michell Froah: And looking at, um, you know, what, what are some of the critical areas where people feel like they, there there might be barriers or difficulties in achieving human progress.

[00:11:21] Michell Froah: Mm-hmm. And, um, there’s some very interesting insights that, that came out of that. Um, you know, there’s a full report on our website that, uh, you, you know, is, is, uh, able to be downloaded, but some that stick with me are that across the globe, um, over 60% of of people you know who are employees have anxiety about Fogo Mm.

[00:11:47] Michell Froah: Fear, fear of being obsolete. Mm. The rapid pace of change. Mm-hmm. Now you might think, oh, that’s only, that’s generational. Maybe it’s the older generation. No, it’s [00:12:00] actually higher for Gen Z. Wow. 5% of Gen Z have fopo. Whoa. Um, yeah. And you know, I think that’s, uh, having a couple Gen Zs myself, um, you know, I, I see that, um, in, in their quest for.

[00:12:19] Michell Froah: Um, finding, you know, where do I fit in, in, in the working world with ai, um, sometimes even taking over some of these entry, uh, level roles. 

[00:12:29] Mm-hmm. 

[00:12:29] Michell Froah: Some of those functions. Um, I, I think, uh, this generation is, is feeling a lot of anxiety, uh, due to that. Awesome. Um, some of the other interesting insights I think, you know, are, um, that over 55% of of the respondents agree that they don’t understand how their skills compare to the, their peers.

[00:12:54] Michell Froah: We don’t have a measuring stick for skills. They’re technical [00:13:00] and sometimes those durable skills and you know, we say durable versus like soft because. There’s nothing soft about them, they’re just hard to measure. 

[00:13:09] Mm-hmm. 

[00:13:10] Michell Froah: Um, right. And, and these are very transferable skills that you need over the course of, of your career, but also you need to pair those with, with your technical skills to be able to be successful.

[00:13:24] Mm-hmm. 

[00:13:24] Michell Froah: Um, so because they don’t understand how they compare to their peers, um, the majority of people, over 85% of people say that they would wanna certify their skills because they think that improves their chance of securing a better or higher paying job, but also helps their career trajectory. Mm-hmm.

[00:13:45] Michell Froah: So. So, you know, really thinking about how we use measurement and advancing the science of measurement to help people demonstrate, demonstrate skill proficiency mm-hmm. Is so core to our [00:14:00] mission and, um, we think also core to helping humans progress. 

[00:14:05] Stan Sthanunathan: Beautiful, very well articulated. Mayor, thank you so much.

[00:14:09] Stan Sthanunathan: Uh, you know, you, you referred to durable skills, uh, and also, you know, you talked about transferability across industries. Can you talk a little bit more about that from your own personal experience? And, uh, and you know, along the way, can you also talk about future nav? 

[00:14:27] Michell Froah: Sure. Yeah. Yeah. One of my favorite topics.

[00:14:30] Michell Froah: Thank you for asking. Well, you know, I think, um, I’d come back to my, my earlier, uh, story just, just for a moment about starting in a manufacturing plant early in my career. Um, you know, I, I think being, frankly, being 22 and, uh, being put in a management position, um. Allowed me to, um, really hone some of those, those durable skills.

[00:14:59] Mm. And 

[00:14:59] Michell Froah: I [00:15:00] have found that I have, um, you know, leaned in on, on utilizing those throughout my career. Mm-hmm. Doesn’t matter if, you know, across all of the, the roles that I’ve had. Um, I’ve been in different functions, so, you know, in, in product supply for example, or manufacturing, I’ve been in different aspects of brand, whether that’s, you know, design, um, upstream design, p and l or, or even, um, at p and GI was in shopper marketing when, when that was kind of a new thing.

[00:15:31] Michell Froah: And, um, and then in cross-functional broadening assignments like sales. Um, I’ve been at the global, the regional, the local level. Um, you know, I, I. I, I’ve, I’ve lived in Singapore, ran across apac. It doesn’t matter what role, what function, uh, and where I’ve been, um, and what new challenges put in front of me, I would say.

[00:15:55] Michell Froah: Mm-hmm. I tend to go back to some of those, uh, real [00:16:00] transferable skills, like leadership, hard thing to, to measure, right? But fi, figuring out how you can be useful. As a leader, um, I think has, has been something that, um, you know, I’ve, I’ve carried through with me. So as, as a real example, talking about insights, right?

[00:16:23] Michell Froah: And, and insight leaders and being very technical. Um, even though when I was, when I was on the line, you know, and managing a, a, a manufacturing line, even though I had an engineering degree. That didn’t mean that I could physically go online and fix, you know, the filling machine mm-hmm. By myself. Mm-hmm. I did not have that technical skill.

[00:16:52] Michell Froah: I was definitely not certified to do that. 

[00:16:54] Yeah. Um, 

[00:16:54] Michell Froah: but that wasn’t my role as the leader. Right. Um, my, my role [00:17:00] wasn’t doing the work mm-hmm. Of the people on my team. My role was understanding the barriers and the challenges they had and figuring out how I could help remove those barriers and challenges so they could do the work that they needed to get done, or it was.

[00:17:20] Michell Froah: Helping them strategically problem solve. Mm. Uh, we used to do a lot of five s if you, if you remember that in the day. Mm-hmm. Um, and, uh, you know, and help strategically problem solve. I’ve used those. Techniques and tools and thoughts about leadership in all of my, um, in all of my roles, particularly when I’ve had, uh, marketing science teams that, you know, are, are part of my marketing team.

[00:17:49] Mm-hmm. 

[00:17:50] Michell Froah: And, you know, a, a lot of times it’s like, oh, we do research and we do insights, and, you know, and, and then we. Check out a report. No, that’s not, that’s not the [00:18:00] intent of marketing science, right? You have to put a new, uh, thought on. How do you help creative problem solving with analysis and data and let the people that you know are, are experts, right?

[00:18:16] Michell Froah: In doing that analysis, um. Shine. So I think leadership is definitely one. Um, I do think this, uh, this notion, uh, like I talked about as well, of um, learning general management skills and how to, um, enable collaboration across functions. Or divisions or departments that you might have within your function and not let people get siloed, um, is, is a huge skill.

[00:18:49] Michell Froah: And again, one that, um, you know, I, I think, uh, is. Is critically important that people don’t, and me included, you know, we [00:19:00] don’t get so focused on my result, 

[00:19:03] um, 

[00:19:04] Michell Froah: versus our shared results and, and having a shared ambition. So, so those are some of those durable skills. I, uh, and then I honestly, the last one, um, I think is, uh, resiliency and, you know, you’re gonna.

[00:19:22] Michell Froah: You’re gonna face challenges. Sometimes you’re gonna win, sometimes you’re gonna go, Hmm, that’s a learning experience. Um, but having the, the curiosity, uh, to live, I always say, to live life on a startup curve, going back to again, to engineering, um, and, and be able to be resilient and pivot, I think is, is a durable skill that, that we all need.

[00:19:48] Michell Froah: Absolutely. So, yeah. If I pivot to Future Nav? Yeah. Um, you know, I, I think that, um, future Nav is. [00:20:00] Is, is a, is a solution that, um, we’re bringing to, to the workforce. Um, it’s an enterprise solution and it helps measure and map individual skills, both technical and, and durable. 

[00:20:16] Mm-hmm. 

[00:20:17] Michell Froah: Um, and really, um, it provides actionable insights both for the individual.

[00:20:26] Michell Froah: To understand where their proficiency levels are and how they actually can grow those proficiency levels, right, through actionable insights, but also for the talent acquisition or the talent, um, upskilling, reskilling decision makers. 

[00:20:43] Mm-hmm. 

[00:20:43] Michell Froah: Because you can look at these, um, results, we call them skill prints.

[00:20:48] Michell Froah: So a future nav skill print is almost like you’re. Individual, um, fingerprint their skill proficiencies and talent. Decision makers then can look [00:21:00] at those in aggregate so they can make decisions on job fit. For individual y, you know, uh, jobs that, that, that they’re trying to fill, but also across departments or levels or regions or however they want to, um, cut those insights and help develop plans to upskill and reskill their, their organizations.

[00:21:23] Mm-hmm. 

[00:21:24] Michell Froah: Um, so I, you know, I, I we’re so excited about launching, um, future Nav. It’s based on. You know, again, our expertise in, um, measuring. Um, the, you know, the science of measurement and, uh, decades of, of research, uh, that back up our, our measurement and applying it really to a new area, uh, which is the workforce.

[00:21:52] Michell Froah: And so I think it’s, you know, one, a very credible way, um, and a very objective [00:22:00] way, um, to help, uh, make talent management decisions that really opens up opportunities for all. 

[00:22:07] Stan Sthanunathan: Beautiful. Beautiful. Well put. So Michelle, you know, there’s not a day that passes without you hearing the word ai. Yeah. So based on, you know, your vantage point, how should insights professionals think about ai?

[00:22:27] Stan Sthanunathan: Is it a threat? I.

[00:22:32] Michell Froah: I think anything’s a threat if you think it is. Right? I think this is a, this is a mindset. 

[00:22:38] Stan Sthanunathan: I think we’re aligned there. Yeah. Right. 

[00:22:41] Michell Froah: Yeah. Um, uh, you know, I, I’d come back to a, a couple of points. One is, um, another insight that came out of our human progress report this year is that AI literacy is a skill.

[00:22:56] Mm. 

[00:22:57] Michell Froah: And if we, and it’s emerged as a top [00:23:00] skill, um, that’s required to be competitive in today’s job market. And, um, you know, and, and this is really coming from both angles, I think from a, a personal, you know, individual employee angle, um, we had, you know, more than six in 10 people that. Believe that, you know, AI literacy and problem solving, um, and technical skills are really needed.

[00:23:29] Michell Froah: Uh, and they want to receive credentials to show that they have those skills. 

[00:23:35] Mm-hmm. 

[00:23:36] Michell Froah: Now on the other, on the other side, we also, with part of our human progress report, we, um, interviewed a thousand, um, uh, talent decision makers, um, in the US and they, um, they also felt that AI literacy is one of the, of the top skills needed and that there’s a [00:24:00] gap in being able to assess.

[00:24:02] Hmm. 

[00:24:04] Michell Froah: Ability to do that. And so, um, with Future Nav, uh, we have an assessment called Future Nav, adapt AI that measures AI literacy, um, in a very situational way, um, so that people can get insights on, on their, uh, literacy levels and their proficiency, but also. Uh, growth, growth paths and personalized, uh, development pathways.

[00:24:30] Michell Froah: Mm-hmm. So I would say, you know, a couple of things, like, we’re gonna have to figure out how to work with ai. Right? It’s, and, and not against it. It’s here to stay. Right. It’s, it’s not going anywhere. Um, I think it’s our responsibility, um, all of us, um, to, uh. Be able to use AI responsibly and ethically. So, you know, we need, we need to think about how we use AI for good.

[00:24:58] Michell Froah: Mm-hmm. Um, now [00:25:00] in, in some cases, you know, our, our assessments are powered by AI so that we can get AI powered insights quickly and reliably and, and things back to individuals and talent decision makers, et cetera. 

[00:25:14] Mm-hmm. 

[00:25:14] Michell Froah: Um, but you know, I think in order to. Um, as, as business leaders, in order to think about how we use those responsibly and ethically, we have to work with our other functional partners in new ways.

[00:25:29] Michell Froah: Got it. So how do we work with our technical teams? Um, how do we work with legal? Um, you know, and, and how do we set up, uh, responsible AI guidelines? Um, not only, you know, within our companies, but what we expect, um, in working with, with other companies or other products and services. 

[00:25:51] Stan Sthanunathan: Alright, so Michel, and as you talk about, you know, you’re obviously very passionate about, uh, skill development.

[00:25:59] Stan Sthanunathan: Uh. [00:26:00] Based on your extensive experience, what tips do you have for young professionals, uh, in terms of how they can accelerate skill development in a world around them that is changing at an incredible pace? I. 

[00:26:16] Michell Froah: So, um, you know, I think, uh, leaning into, leaning into the durable skills of, uh, curiosity and, um, agility or, or, or even, you know, resilience, I think are gonna be incredibly important.

[00:26:33] Michell Froah: That’s, that is a mindset that people need to have. 

[00:26:37] Mm-hmm. 

[00:26:37] Michell Froah: And if you have a mindset that I’m done with. School. Mm-hmm. Right. And education. And I don’t need to learn anymore. Um, I think you’re gonna stall as, as a individual and, and the success you can achieve. So upskilling and reskilling is an incredibly [00:27:00] important.

[00:27:00] Michell Froah: A 

[00:27:00] Stan Sthanunathan: lifelong activity. 

[00:27:02] Michell Froah: Right. Lifelong activity, of course. Mm. And so, um, you know, that’s on the rise. And, and we’re, we’re seeing that people want more ability to showcase their credentials, showcase their certifications, um, you know, in, in these areas. So if people are, are moving that direction right, then a new benchmark’s gonna be set.

[00:27:28] Hmm. 

[00:27:29] Michell Froah: So people real. So you really need to embrace upskilling and reskilling. Um, so in, or again, in order to do that, I think you need sound measurement tools and solutions that allow people to demonstrate that and benchmark. 

[00:27:45] Mm-hmm. 

[00:27:45] Michell Froah: Um, and you know, we have, um, we, we truly believe that skill-based hiring is one of those ways to embrace that approach.

[00:27:57] Michell Froah: So we need to. [00:28:00] Um, how do we recast what a job is? 

[00:28:05] Hmm. 

[00:28:05] Michell Froah: That really just experience and formal, uh, prerequisites. 

[00:28:13] Hmm, 

[00:28:14] Michell Froah: right? Or is it. A job is a bundle of skills that someone needs to demonstrate. Mm-hmm. And does that open up new opportunities for people, for example, to go from engineering into marketing or from, you know, finance into, uh, technology or vice versa, or, you know, you know, how, how can we open up the, the aperture for people to think about new careers, new jobs?

[00:28:45] Michell Froah: Especially as technology and AI are changing what the future of jobs might be. Mm-hmm. The jobs of today, like I, um, I’m, I’m, uh, not recalling the stat here on, off the top of my [00:29:00] head, but, you know, I think there was a, a, a, a report that came out on, um. From the bur bureau of, of, um, of jobs and, and, and the future of them that 60% of the jobs or something in that range that exist today are not gonna be the jobs of the future.

[00:29:19] Michell Froah: Right. So, um, and you would think those jobs of the future are gonna need a different skillset. So we’re gonna have to think about upskilling and reskilling if we’re gonna remain relevant in, in that future state. Hmm. Um, so I think, you know, um, tips would be one, you know, have that, that create or that, uh, agile, resilient, and curious.

[00:29:46] Michell Froah: Mindset and treat those, uh, as a skill. Mm-hmm. Um, and then to actively look for ways to upskill re-skill and actually certify or credential yourself in the [00:30:00] demonstration. Mm-hmm. Um, of, of those skills. 

[00:30:04] Stan Sthanunathan: Awesome. I’m gonna pivot a little bit here, Miguel. Uh, you have done a lot of senior marketing roles. Uh, can you, uh.

[00:30:13] Stan Sthanunathan: Based on all those roles, can you tell us what are the biggest challenges that you think are facing the insights professionals today? Uh, and how do you think, you know, they should adapt and, uh, adopt new things to stay relevant? I. 

[00:30:32] Michell Froah: So are specifically senior marketing roles? 

[00:30:35] Stan Sthanunathan: No. The senior. From your vantage point as a senior marketing person, I’m just zeroing it on your perspective on what should insights professionals do mm-hmm.

[00:30:46] Stan Sthanunathan: Really become relevant and meaningful and, you know, impactful going forward. 

[00:30:53] Michell Froah: Yeah. I think, um, it’s, it’s a great question. I think. I’m, I’m gonna go [00:31:00] back to, um, some of my, my, uh, experience at, at MetLife actually. 

[00:31:07] Mm-hmm. Uh, 

[00:31:08] Michell Froah: and I had the, uh, I guess, I guess interesting experience of being at MetLife during Covid.

[00:31:15] Michell Froah: Mm-hmm. Um, and I think that a lot of, a lot of times, insights. Professionals are thought of as market research professionals. 

[00:31:29] Hmm. 

[00:31:30] Michell Froah: And so we are asked to go off and do a study and then do a readout report. 

[00:31:40] Mm-hmm. 

[00:31:41] Michell Froah: Right? Mm-hmm. So every team I’ve ever taken on, um, you know, under marketing and, and had, it’s, it’s always been called something like insights or market research or consumer research or something like that.

[00:31:55] Michell Froah: And we made a concerted effort, uh, frankly, [00:32:00] to rebrand that team, if you will, um, into a team called Marketing Science. Mm-hmm. And, and that was intentional because. Um, what I didn’t want was a group of folks that felt like they were order takers. Hmm. Right. And that I go, I go conduct this study, I give a hundred page readout, um, and it’s up to the business or the function, or whoever I did the study for to figure out what are the actionable insights.

[00:32:34] Mm-hmm. 

[00:32:35] Michell Froah: Right. So I think becoming, um, a putting on your, your business leader or business partner, how about that? Um, pat, right? And thinking about first starting with what business strategy am I trying to, am I being asked to [00:33:00] help, uh, inform, 

[00:33:01] mm-hmm. 

[00:33:02] Michell Froah: Right. With this research mm-hmm. Or with this study mm-hmm.

[00:33:06] Michell Froah: Then helps you create hypotheses first mm-hmm. Before you go conduct the research. Mm-hmm. And, and I feel like that dialogue between insights professionals and, uh, or the marketing science professionals and the businesses or, or the functions, or whoever their customer is, their internal customer, um, is so important before you just run off and do a study.

[00:33:30] Michell Froah: Okay. Right. Um, and so, so that then when you use, um, uh, you know that to form. Your study, you also can use that to form, I would say, new analytical approaches to get to those true insights. Mm-hmm. Not accepted customer beliefs or, you know, like, you know, the, the same same that, that you’re gonna come out with, but [00:34:00] true insights that can be put into action to drive change.

[00:34:05] Michell Froah: Got it. And um, so, you know, at MetLife during Covid, um, to come back to my example. Um, you know, there’s people were always interested in, in these reports, but I think all of a sudden covid hit and everyone went, oh my gosh, I wonder what people are thinking. Like, do we have a real voice of customer program?

[00:34:33] Michell Froah: Do we have real insights from our customers that can help drive action? And so we, we stood up two programs during Covid. Mm-hmm. Um, that were pretty intense. Um, one was doing a pulse across the globe, um, that. Frankly, it was a lot of work and we changed our mindset and [00:35:00] called ourselves the newsroom. Right.

[00:35:03] Michell Froah: So this wasn’t like, we did a pulse every month in 11 countries, and people didn’t want to know three months from now what the report said, you know, three months ago. 

[00:35:18] Mm-hmm. 

[00:35:18] Michell Froah: They wanted to. Tomorrow, what the results were from yesterday. So putting on our newsroom hat, we were like, how do we ingest this data quickly, come up with, you know, actionable insights and get those out there for people to use immediately?

[00:35:39] And 

[00:35:39] Michell Froah: we used new, um, analytical tools. We used more of a. A newsroom approach where we were, um, you know, it wasn’t a ladder of let, let me put a report together, share it with my manager, share it with their manager, share it with me, you know, kind of thing. It was all of us in one room in the [00:36:00] newsroom saying, what’s the headline?

[00:36:01] Yep. Uh, 

[00:36:02] Michell Froah: what’s the, what’s the takeaway? Um, how do we get this out there? You know, we had webinars, we had one-to-one sessions. We had, you know, a hundred ways we could cut the data quickly, you know, all of these, all of these new approaches, and that was so refreshing. 

[00:36:19] The 

[00:36:20] Michell Froah: second thing we did was stand up, um, a relationship Net Promoter Score program across those same groups.

[00:36:27] Mm-hmm. 

[00:36:28] Michell Froah: And it was, um, more of a competitive benchmark. 

[00:36:33] Mm-hmm. 

[00:36:34] Michell Froah: Um, but also used new analytical tools that got to, you know, important drivers analysis that helped the business leaders then in those markets say, these are the important things that it’s not a hundred things I need to work on. It’s one or two things that.

[00:36:57] Michell Froah: Then drive that [00:37:00] overall method and and score, and it was all very data driven. 

[00:37:04] Mm-hmm. 

[00:37:05] Michell Froah: So I, again, I think that. Partnering with your business leaders or, or the, your internal customer to really understand the strategy and help them design the research that’s going to help inform that strategy and the action plans is the, the key, um, success to 

[00:37:26] Stan Sthanunathan: success patient.

[00:37:29] Stan Sthanunathan: Thank you so much for incredibly stimulating session today. You know, the, the old adage is you can never teach an old monkey new tricks. Is it the monkey 

[00:37:40] or the dog? 

[00:37:42] Stan Sthanunathan: Monkeys. You proved that wrong. I’m walking away with a few new tricks and I really thank you for that. You know, I am sure our audience will learn a lot from this session.

[00:37:55] Stan Sthanunathan: And thank you once again. Really appreciate the time so much. It’s been a pleasure. [00:38:00] It’s been an 

 

[00:38:00] MRII Announcer: absolute pleasure. Thanks for joining the Insights and Innovators podcast for Market Research Institute International. Click subscribe to never miss an episode, and visit us@ri.org for more market research insights.